Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
variables indépendantes provoquées/invoquées
English translation:
active/attribute independent variable; manipulated/measured
Added to glossary by
Jack Sims
Mar 8, 2016 17:16
8 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term
variables indépendantes provoquées/invoquées
French to English
Social Sciences
Mathematics & Statistics
Hi
This is something that's come up in some market research that I'm translating. There's an explanation of the difference here in French https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_indépendante
The page states:
On l'appelle variable indépendante parce qu'elle ne dépend pas du sujet observé. Il existe deux types de variables indépendantes: les variables indépendantes invoquées et les variables indépendantes contrôlées (ou provoquées).
I'm wondering how we render this in English.
Would the provoquées actually be what we call "controlled variables" in English and the invoquées what we simply call "independent variables"?
Any ideas very welcome!
Thanks
Jack
This is something that's come up in some market research that I'm translating. There's an explanation of the difference here in French https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_indépendante
The page states:
On l'appelle variable indépendante parce qu'elle ne dépend pas du sujet observé. Il existe deux types de variables indépendantes: les variables indépendantes invoquées et les variables indépendantes contrôlées (ou provoquées).
I'm wondering how we render this in English.
Would the provoquées actually be what we call "controlled variables" in English and the invoquées what we simply call "independent variables"?
Any ideas very welcome!
Thanks
Jack
Proposed translations
(English)
| 5 | active/attribute independent variable |
Didier Fourcot
|
| 5 | control variables vs exogenous variables |
Francois Boye
|
| 3 | Explanatory/contolled independent variables |
dwt2
|
| 3 | manipulated/measured |
DLyons
|
Proposed translations
29 mins
Selected
active/attribute independent variable
Explication très claire dans l'article ci-dessous, pour une fois Wikipedia a un article en français que l'anglais n'a pas (avis aux amateurs anglophones)
attribute (invoquée):
"One example of an attribute variable is gender. If a study compared men and women on a dependent variable (e.g., response to this new MiracleX drug), then gender would be an attribute independent variable in that study. The study compared the groups, but the investigators did not - and could not - choose which subjects were men, and which were women ;?). "
active (provoquée)
"An active independent variable is one that is designed, imposed, controlled by the investigators. This is the highest level of independent variables, met by true experimental studies. "
attribute (invoquée):
"One example of an attribute variable is gender. If a study compared men and women on a dependent variable (e.g., response to this new MiracleX drug), then gender would be an attribute independent variable in that study. The study compared the groups, but the investigators did not - and could not - choose which subjects were men, and which were women ;?). "
active (provoquée)
"An active independent variable is one that is designed, imposed, controlled by the investigators. This is the highest level of independent variables, met by true experimental studies. "
2 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "This is the answer I used and it makes sense to me and DLyons answer seems equivalent conceptually but I wasn't really able to assess Francois Boye's response properly though he provided a good source. Perhaps this can be added to further down the line."
58 mins
Explanatory/contolled independent variables
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Didier Fourcot
: explanatory and controlled variables are mentioned as synonyms of independent in this reference, this is not an answer to the question?
55 mins
|
8 hrs
Francois Boye
United States
United States
Native in French
Specializes in field
United States
An economic geek with social skills
Native in: French 
Works in: English to French, French to English, Spanish to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
13
control variables vs exogenous variables
Note from asker:
| I'm trying to grade this but I don't really understand how your answer tallies with the suggestions by DLyons and Didier Fourcot - who for me are using different words to describe the same thing |
1 hr
French term (edited):
provoquées/invoquées
manipulated/measured
It can get a bit subtle at times :-) e.g.
http://math.tutorvista.com/algebra/independent-variable.html
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Note added at 2 hrs (2016-03-08 19:36:12 GMT)
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Not sure I understand your question - but an experimenter can only measure attributes like gender, weight, ethnicity ... On the other hand they can potentially change dosage, diet etc. Is that what you're asking?
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Note added at 2 hrs (2016-03-08 19:39:01 GMT)
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https://books.google.ie/books?id=9MzvVEed_SQC&pg=PA69
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Note added at 2 hrs (2016-03-08 19:41:14 GMT)
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Here's a better ref https://books.google.ie/books?id=QaEmtpLyVooC&pg=PA3
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Note added at 4 days (2016-03-13 11:43:56 GMT)
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Thanks Jack - good to see someone agrees with me :-)
http://math.tutorvista.com/algebra/independent-variable.html
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Note added at 2 hrs (2016-03-08 19:36:12 GMT)
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Not sure I understand your question - but an experimenter can only measure attributes like gender, weight, ethnicity ... On the other hand they can potentially change dosage, diet etc. Is that what you're asking?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2016-03-08 19:39:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
https://books.google.ie/books?id=9MzvVEed_SQC&pg=PA69
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2016-03-08 19:41:14 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Here's a better ref https://books.google.ie/books?id=QaEmtpLyVooC&pg=PA3
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Note added at 4 days (2016-03-13 11:43:56 GMT)
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Thanks Jack - good to see someone agrees with me :-)
Note from asker:
| So what's the difference between an attribute, manipulated and controlled variable? |
| Yes in agreement with DLyons here manipulated/measured would seem to describe the same thing as Didier Fourcot's active/attribute answer |
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Didier Fourcot
: measured i snot mentioned in this reference, but in WP ref from answer above, this means "dependent"
54 mins
|
| neutral |
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
: It may be me, but I think you have misread the question. Your suggestion is about the difference between indep/dep variables. The question indicates that the distinction to be made here is between two types of independent variable.
20 hrs
|
|
I think it is you Nikki :-)
|
Reference comments
21 hrs
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Native in English
Psychologist, Court-certified legal
Native in: English
Works in: French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
8
Reference:
Explanation for meaning in French
http://tecfa.unige.ch/tecfa/teaching/UVLibre/0001/bin69/b_pl...
Les variables.
[...]. Deux catégories de variables indépendantes peuvent déjà être distinguées : les variables invoquées et les variables provoquées.
Les variables indépendantes.
Les variables invoquées ou organismiques : ce sont les caractéristiques relativement stables d'un organisme, tant sur le plan psychologique ou sur le plan culturel (sexe ; couleur des yeux ; taille ; poids ; intelligence ; niveau d'instruction ; anxiété ; introversion-extraversion ; culture ; religion ; etc).
Les variables provoquées (ou les variables-stimulus).
Dans une expérimentation au sens strict, la variable indépendante peut être considérée comme un stimulus dans la mesure où ce mot se réfère de façon très large à tout aspect de l'environnement - physique (bruit, lumière…) ; social (nombre de personne présentes, etc) ; interne (drogue…) qui excite des récepteurs et provoque des modifications comportementales ou " réponse ". En général, les variables provoquées peuvent prendre plusieurs valeurs au gré des choix de l'expérimentateur ; on appelle ces valeurs les modalités ou les états de la variable.
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Note added at 22 hrs (2016-03-09 15:20:49 GMT)
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http://j.b.legal.free.fr/Blog/share/Dynamiques/Methodo.pdf
p2 :
"Il3 existe3 plusieurs3 types3 de3 variables :3 les3 Variables3 Indépendantes3 (VI),3 les3 Variables3
Dépendantes3(VD),3les3Variables3Parasites3(VP)3et3les3Variables3Contrôlées3(VC).
2@1) La%variable%indépendante.
See pp2-3.
I'm not copying it here as a figure é3" is inserted in each single space!
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Note added at 22 hrs (2016-03-09 15:25:10 GMT)
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But basically it says that two types of VI can be distinguisehd :
- "VI provoquée" are those with characteristics relating to the subject's physical or social environment
- "VI invoquée" with characteristics inherent to the subject.
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Note added at 22 hrs (2016-03-09 15:35:46 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
In context, with more information about the experimental (and/or) research context, a document such as the one posted in reference by François Boye may help you decide which type of VI is being intended. Stats terminology has to be precise but there are sometimes more than one term for the same thing, depending on context and with variations from one institution to the next.
Les variables.
[...]. Deux catégories de variables indépendantes peuvent déjà être distinguées : les variables invoquées et les variables provoquées.
Les variables indépendantes.
Les variables invoquées ou organismiques : ce sont les caractéristiques relativement stables d'un organisme, tant sur le plan psychologique ou sur le plan culturel (sexe ; couleur des yeux ; taille ; poids ; intelligence ; niveau d'instruction ; anxiété ; introversion-extraversion ; culture ; religion ; etc).
Les variables provoquées (ou les variables-stimulus).
Dans une expérimentation au sens strict, la variable indépendante peut être considérée comme un stimulus dans la mesure où ce mot se réfère de façon très large à tout aspect de l'environnement - physique (bruit, lumière…) ; social (nombre de personne présentes, etc) ; interne (drogue…) qui excite des récepteurs et provoque des modifications comportementales ou " réponse ". En général, les variables provoquées peuvent prendre plusieurs valeurs au gré des choix de l'expérimentateur ; on appelle ces valeurs les modalités ou les états de la variable.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2016-03-09 15:20:49 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
http://j.b.legal.free.fr/Blog/share/Dynamiques/Methodo.pdf
p2 :
"Il3 existe3 plusieurs3 types3 de3 variables :3 les3 Variables3 Indépendantes3 (VI),3 les3 Variables3
Dépendantes3(VD),3les3Variables3Parasites3(VP)3et3les3Variables3Contrôlées3(VC).
2@1) La%variable%indépendante.
See pp2-3.
I'm not copying it here as a figure é3" is inserted in each single space!
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2016-03-09 15:25:10 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
But basically it says that two types of VI can be distinguisehd :
- "VI provoquée" are those with characteristics relating to the subject's physical or social environment
- "VI invoquée" with characteristics inherent to the subject.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2016-03-09 15:35:46 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
In context, with more information about the experimental (and/or) research context, a document such as the one posted in reference by François Boye may help you decide which type of VI is being intended. Stats terminology has to be precise but there are sometimes more than one term for the same thing, depending on context and with variations from one institution to the next.
Note from asker:
| Thanks for this |
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